16:32:28 RWelt enters this room
16:32:29 >[RWelt] Welcome to our chat. Please obey the net etiquette while chatting: try to be pleasant and polite.
16:34:39 RAW enters this room
16:35:22 [RWelt] Well hello there!
16:35:40 [RAW] test one two
16:36:07 [RWelt] receiving you five by five
16:36:41 [RAW] hello there ,I’ll be back in 15 minutes
16:37:03 [RWelt] no problem, still trying to finish dinner
16:49:16 acrillic enters this room
16:49:59 [RWelt] welcome, acrillic
16:50:01 [acrillic] Namaste
16:50:59 [RAW] hi there!
16:51:46 [RAW] refresh/30
16:51:52 [acrillic] waves hands frantic
16:52:27 [RWelt] maybe it’s still a little early, but I was expecting more of a turnout
16:53:06 [acrillic] umm, me too. thought the whole planet
16:54:10 [RAW] i just heard a few hours ago that bush and kerry are not only related to eachother (nineth cousins) bet they are also related to vlad dracul–the historical prototype for dracula
16:54:19 Matt enters this room
16:54:36 [RWelt] that’s awesome
16:54:39 [acrillic] Im reading about guts above, ive a steady hand and step. whoops, tripps and rolls off stool.
16:55:01 bandito enters this room
16:55:09 [RAW] the village voice this week has pitcture of george bush with fangs sucking the blood ofthe statue of liberty in the classic bela lugosi pose , this must mean something ?
16:55:17 [acrillic] Ooo the Impaler, they both look like they got pockers up the booty
16:55:57 [acrillic] Vampires suck.
16:55:58 [bandito] banditos in tha house
16:57:12 [acrillic] matt/bandito – hi y’all, welcome, greetings.
16:57:15 [RAW] this means bush and kerry are also related to the Usual Suspects—bonnie prince charly, the von hapsbergs, the jacobites, and the whole priory of scion genealogy, what next?
16:57:51 [Matt] Hi everyone
16:58:10 [bandito] hello…
16:58:11 [acrillic] Bloody hell, Bush and Kerry related by blood….clot!
16:58:34 [RWelt] do you think any notable figure can have figures like this in their ancestry, or is this really a special case?
16:59:20 [acrillic] I remeber a gameshow on T.V – family fortunes, where your family can compete wid others for Cash prizes, and cars and shit.
16:59:36 [RWelt] though i admit, either way, it’s fascinating
17:00:28 [bandito] sometimes I just think it’s old money types just staying within their own circle
17:00:59 [RAW] babys suck by the way, welcome bandito and matt and everyone
17:01:18 [RWelt] i think that’s probably a big part of it, bandito
17:02:19 [RAW] in an old european proverb: royals only mary royals, seems true this side of the atlantic too
17:02:49 [bandito] my baby (5.5 months) puts everything in his month – oral-survival right in front of me
17:03:21 [RAW] where are all of you on the earth?
17:03:40 [bandito] Golden, Colorado
17:04:10 [Matt] I’m in Munster, Indiana
17:04:12 [RWelt] Albuquerque, New Mexico… where Bugs Bunny makes all his wrong turns
17:04:23 [RAW] ive been there to CO, i lectured at an engineering college there once
17:04:30 [bandito] LOL
17:04:48 [bandito] No kidding! Colorado School of Mines???
17:04:51 [RAW] never been to either of those places …sorry
17:04:59 [acrillic] Brooklyn, NY
17:05:10 [RAW] YES that was it !
17:05:32 [RAW] i was born in brooklyn and proud of it!
17:05:45 [RWelt] you haven’t really missed much by not having been here
17:06:01 [bandito] I’m stunned! I have a BS and MS from Mines. My wife has a BS. We just had our 10 year reunion of sorts.
17:06:14 [bandito] small world
17:06:31 [Matt] Munster is close to Crown Point…
17:06:34 [acrillic] Yeah, i was born in Wordsley
17:07:12 [RWelt] was in brooklyn for a family wedding a few months back
17:07:15 [acrillic] Wordsly, Mid Westlands, UK
17:07:44 [RAW] can any of you guess why Simon Moon’s first words in Illumintus! are : crown point?
17:08:27 [RWelt] it has something to do with kether, right?
17:08:58 [Matt] Dillinger and the jail?
17:09:23 [acrillic] Kings. Sepheroph. wearing the crown. Kether. Top Hat
17:09:36 [bandito] Moon’s tantric practices?
17:09:47 [RWelt] all of the above?
17:09:50 [RAW] yeah kether means crown and is symbolized geometricly by a point, crown point was also the escape proof jail that dillinger blashemously escaped from in defiance to the laws of physics and the United States.
17:10:37 [acrillic] Right on Mat.
17:10:42 [RAW] yea verily
17:10:45 [RWelt] man, i’m so far behind in the illuminatus course
17:11:09 [bandito] me too, about two chapters back..
17:11:13 [RAW] since this is the end of the course are there any questions you want to ask?
17:12:02 [bandito] how do you see ideograms in relation to internet?
17:12:08 [RWelt] i still have troubles expressing what ideogrammic method “means” in words… is there a short simple way you can sum it up?
17:12:22 [bandito] montage? feedback? organism-as-whole?
17:12:34 [RWelt] i have lots of people who give me a “what the fuck” look when i say i’m taking a course on id. method
17:13:03 [bandito] I meant that as a follow up to my question, not as a reply to RWelt’s question…
17:13:21 [acrillic] what did you eat for breakfast?
17:13:31 [RWelt] lol, i assumed that… both of us hurriedly typing away…
17:13:39 [Matt] Me too, RWelt
17:13:49 [RAW] the ideograms define by giving concrete particulars , where as western philosophy defines by abstractions
17:15:02 [RAW] for example energy is the capacity to do work (western) or as against energy equals man with shovel , horse pulling cart, electric generator, waterfall, atomic bomb, etc.
17:15:11 [RAW] is that clear?
17:15:43 [acrillic] Concrete like “Root” similarity with natural phenomena
17:15:49 [RWelt] makes sense to me, looks clear enough to satisfy my friends
17:15:49 [RAW] second ex: western defines individualism as the doctrine that blah blah blah
17:17:04 [RAW] as pound defines individualism as odyseus , sigasmundo malatesta, confucius, thomas jefferson, etc.
17:17:04 [bandito] makes sense. Seems like it would go a long way in clearing lines of communication. less noise.
17:17:48 [RAW] yeah
17:18:14 [RAW] as far as internet see all of the above
17:19:14 [RAW] concrete as specific
17:19:25 [bandito] internet certainly seems like montage
17:19:45 [RAW] as william blake said : he who would do good to other must do so in concrete particulars
17:19:52 [acrillic] how does the Ideo meth in China, differ from our western “Interpretation” of the methd – of chi/ written character?
17:19:59 [RWelt] internet seems like all bandito said earlier… montage, feedback, organism-as-whole…
17:20:15 [RAW] general good is a plague of the hipocrite , scoundrel and flatterer- Blake
17:20:28 [RAW] as a poet Blake thought in ideograms
17:21:10 [RWelt] general good meaning a blanket goodness… to the whole but not necessarily to the individual?
17:21:13 [acrillic] and all the hills echoed>>>>>>>
17:21:39 [RAW] acrilic – i dont get the question, can you redefine?
17:21:56 [bandito] I remember introducing my wife to internet several years ago. She typed in the same phrase in various search engines and got different answers from each one which she found frustrating. Now we seem to have interalized the inheirent “choas” of internet
17:22:04 [RAW] general good meaning what george carlin calls bullshit!
17:22:45 [RAW] bandito – yes that what i like about internet
17:22:47 [RWelt] i love the inherent chaos of internet!
17:23:13 [RAW] i once that certitude who inly look in one encyclopedia, with internt we have various encyclopedias
17:23:22 [acrillic] How do you think the Ideo method, as practised in China “Assimilates” with our English interpretation, how can we improve the communication medium? erm…. acrillc /..drowns in his drink
17:25:12 [RWelt] i think acrillic is after… how does “our” version of id. method differ from how those in China use/see it?
17:25:33 [RWelt] or something akin to that
17:25:37 [RAW] still not sure i understand but i dont expect to become a frenchman by studying french lit or a chinese by studying ideograms yet i think studying french and chinese makes more than an ordinary american, which is worth striving for
17:25:49 [acrillic] Thanks Rwelt.
17:26:43 [Matt] Any suggestions for further study?
17:26:53 [RWelt] more than an ordinary anything is worth striving for, i think
17:27:02 bogusmagus enters this room
17:27:09 [bandito] I would guess that language has an influence on culture and that a study of Chinese culture shed some light on your question…
17:27:17 [acrillic] well Bob your about the most Chinese, irishman i can think of, can i retract the question? he he Oops
17:27:34 [RAW] matt- science and sanity by korzybski
17:28:39 [acrillic] Greetings Bogus
17:28:48 [bandito] any Korzybski popularizations you recommend before plunging into the masterwork?
17:28:50 [RAW] a friend years ago said everytime I took a psychedlelic that i looked chinese
17:28:56 [Matt] Thanks!
17:29:02 [RAW] not sure what that means
17:29:20 [RWelt] did this course give you any new perspectives or ideas that you’ll include in Tale of the Tribe?
17:29:54 [bogusmagus] Hi – just back-tracking and lurking a while
17:30:00 [RAW] welt – it certainly gave me a lot of new ideas and perspectives..yes!
17:30:16 [RWelt] wonderful
17:31:30 [RAW] you could say the use of concrete particulars vs vague generalizations
17:31:38 [RWelt] in regards to all the classes, not just this one, how much do they change from what you originally envisioned?
17:31:57 [RWelt] do they flow pretty much as you expected? or are you constantly altering?
17:32:26 [RAW] they evolved in ways I could not expect or predict. thats why enjoyed them so much and hope to teach more online
17:33:10 [RAW] like everything else in the universe they continually surprise me ( well everything except G.Bush)
17:34:00 [RWelt] I don’t know… Bush continually surprises me, but never in a good way
17:34:08 [bogusmagus] I have greatly enjoyed this particular course because so much was unfamiliar (more surprise, more information?)
17:34:26 [bandito] bogus – any new mcluhan-ideogram insights…
17:34:59 [bogusmagus] that’ll be tomorrow!
17:35:22 [RAW] bandito – there several good ones, but i dont know what is still in print….explorations in awareness by samuel bois, language in thought and action by sam hayakawa
17:35:22 [bogusmagus] Sorry people – got a tooth abcess, brain out of gear
17:35:38 [RAW] and quantumn psychology by me , still in print
17:35:52 [bandito] aha!
17:36:41 [bandito] wish we could all get together and play the world game online.
17:36:50 [RAW] ive had an abcess, god pity you sir!
17:37:06 [bogusmagus] Thanks, Bob
17:37:10 [RWelt] me too! i looked at the world game a few months ago, and was filled with a desire to play
17:37:45 [bogusmagus] Hey, how much does it cost, and how do we set up a team?
17:38:24 [bandito] $3500 for them to come to you. Didn’t see an online option.
17:39:07 [bandito] Bois’ book out of print, hayakawa available at amazon.com
17:39:48 [RAW] in that case i recommend hayakawa
17:40:10 [acrillic] Hayakawa has a great essay in Ecetera ecetera compendium.
17:40:32 [RAW] while youre at it check and see if the ‘power of words’ by stewart chase is till in print
17:41:24 [bandito] Power of words out of print. I found Bois at half.com
17:42:15 [bandito] Power of words @ half.com as well….
17:42:20 [RAW] look for operational philosophy by anatole rapoport
17:42:59 [RAW] i also recommend the open society and its enemies by Karl Popper
17:43:14 [RAW] and selected prose by Ezra Pound
17:44:05 [RWelt] I’ve already got a list of over 60 books to read….looks like it might be growing
17:44:23 [bandito] Whee! this is fun! Operational philosophy out of print, but amazon has 10 used copies. Bless internet.
17:44:24 [bogusmagus] I just got hold of a ‘popular’ book – Drive Yourself Sane – anyone know it?
17:45:02 [RWelt] bogus- i’ve heard the name, but that’s about all i know of it
17:45:21 [RAW] Ive read it…its ok, the guy who wrote it supports G.Bush, so be warned!
17:46:10 [RAW] He should try driving himself sane.
17:46:29 [bogusmagus] OK – but he’s quoting you as a ref on this website http://www.driveyourselfsane.com/dysbook/dysbook.html
17:47:08 [bandito] lol!
17:47:10 [RAW] he has a right to do that if he wants to
17:47:19 [acrillic] I picked up the Trial of Ezra Pound. Bob, do you find Julian Cornell’s book a fair, balanced work? book?
17:48:05 [RAW] acrili – almost, not entirely….balanced but far from complete
17:49:07 [bandito] I must say that reading Pound has finally put some pleasure into poetry (for me)
17:49:38 [RAW] lol
17:49:47 [acrillic] my heart raced as i read the transcripts/broadcasts, wow – MC Pound really got the party jumpin and hearts pumpin.
17:49:53 dalryada enters this room
17:50:04 [RWelt] i’ve really enjoyed Pound also…
17:50:15 [bogusmagus] Me too
17:50:31 [RWelt] most poetry i’ve read has either been poorly written, or has a message no more complex than “flower pretty”
17:50:55 [bogusmagus] It’s been hard when friends say “why are you reading a Fascist and an anti-Semite?”
17:51:01 [acrillic] Pound is a currency ?
17:51:25 [RAW] Non Illuminati carborundum
17:52:05 [bandito] hello dalryada
17:52:19 [dalryada] oh hi, i’m lurking. i know i’m really late. sorry.
17:52:25 [bogusmagus] Even when I say “he was doing broadcasts against American involvement in the war” (which those same friends should approve, maybe?)
17:52:34 [RAW] challenge the is of identity and read korzybski for christ sake!
17:52:37 [bogusmagus] Hi Dal
17:52:51 [dalryada] hi bogus
17:53:15 [RAW] signing off soon
17:53:35 [RWelt] ok, i haven’t been saying it so far, but hi to everyone who’s joined in, glad you’re here
17:54:00 [RWelt] korzybski is high on my list of books to read next (science & sanity)
17:54:01 [RAW] sorry we missed you Dalryada
17:54:03 [acrillic] A pound of currency maybe a pound of Ezra Pound’s flesh.
17:54:21 [dalryada] me too….it rained in arizona and everything went all to HELL!
17:54:48 [bandito] kinda like snow in Texas?
17:54:58 [dalryada] exactly
17:55:19 [RWelt] same way here in new mex… wonder if you got the storm that passed thru last night? not sure which way that was headed
17:55:29 [RAW] thank you all for the inspiration you have provided and the ideas you have jostled.
17:55:34 [Matt] Even though I just lurked, I found the forums very helpful. Thanks to everyone who posted. Your questions and answers helped clear up lots of things for me.
17:55:53 [RAW] See you in the Academy!
17:56:06 [bogusmagus] Be Seeing You!
17:56:09 [bandito] mutual inspiration all around
17:56:13 [dalryada] hi and bye!
17:56:16 [bandito] see you on campus
17:56:22 [RWelt] thank you Bob for giving us this wonderful opportunity
17:57:16 [acrillic] greetings
17:58:02 [RWelt] and thank all the rest of you too, for making this a pleasant experience of exploration
17:58:33 RAW exits from this room
17:59:47 [RWelt] sorry you missed most of it, dalryada
18:00:13 [bogusmagus] I’ve had a great time, but I found this the hardest course – perhaps the most rewarding – I am not sure yet…
18:00:24 [dalryada] yeah, me too. i won’t ask what you guys talked about. i’ll hopefully wait till it’s posted in the forums..
18:00:50 [RWelt] if anyone needs it, i’ve got the whole chat in a Word document
18:00:54 [bogusmagus] more good book titles!
18:01:03 [RWelt] including this stuff… hehehe
18:01:09 [dalryada] oh yeah! oh no.
18:01:16 [dalryada] including this stuff?
18:01:52 [bandito] I love that guy!
18:01:53 [RWelt] yeah, i’m getting everything until i go, which will probably be soon
18:02:06 [RWelt] i know how you feel, bandito
18:02:19 [dalryada] i’d love a copy.
18:02:36 [bogusmagus] I thought I came in after a few minutes – did you start earleir?
18:02:49 [dalryada] so….bogus, you mentioned this was the hardest course for you….me too. Others as well?
18:02:52 [RWelt] anyone who wants a copy, email me at firstname.lastname@example.org
18:02:53 [bogusmagus] I’d like a copy of the earlier stuff, too
18:03:01 [RWelt] let me know if you want a format other than .doc
18:04:49 [bogusmagus] For future reference, how did you save it?
18:04:54 [RWelt] yeah, looks like there’s a good bit before you showed up, bogus
18:05:21 [RWelt] i’ve just been copying & pasting into an open Word document
18:05:45 [bogusmagus] OK
18:06:23 [acrillic] great fun ppl, thanx.
18:06:43 [bogusmagus] Thanx for the pix
18:06:51 [RWelt] yes, again thank all you guys
18:07:23 [acrillic] thanks for the trix
18:07:56 [RWelt] i’ll probably be back online in a few hours… will send out the log to anyone who’s requested it by then
18:08:10 [RWelt] if you request later, you’ll get it within a day at most
18:08:26 [RWelt] bye!
16:32:28 RWelt enters this room
WEEK ONE ASSIGNMENTS
Canto 1 from The Cantos of Ezra Pound and my commentary
[ can you order Pregabalin online Editors note: all Canto commentary here]
Read Fenollosa’s THE CHINESE WRITTEN CHARACTER
Read opening matter & Chapter One of Pound’s ABC OF READING
Read my commentary on Copulating Currency [source unknown]
In the first 2 weeks buy or rent or somehow view DW Griffiths INTOLERANCE and study it as continuous montage — i.e. Ideogrammic Method
Meditate [& if you will, contemplate] upon:
Mottled blueblack sky.
A sudden moon — briefly!
Then: Blueblack mottled sky…
WEEK TWO ASSIGNMENTS
Read Cantos 8 to 11 with my commentaries —
an ideogrammic presentation of one
typically atypical Renaissance man,
Sigismundo Pandolfo Malatesta
Consider ideogrammic method in relation
to the concept of extensional orientation
in General Semantics —
In extension we do not define humans as
mammals, mammals as vertebrates,
vertebrates as life forms etc
as caricatured by Fenollosa.
In extension we define humans as Odysseus,
Helen of Troy, El Cid, Lorenzo de Medici,
Eleanor of Aquitaine, Tom Jefferson,
Cunizza daRomano, John Adams, Kungfutse,
Tai Tsong, Andy Jackson, Yong Ching,
JP Morgan, etc etc as in the ideograms of the Cantos.
Pound & Fenollosa consider ideogram the
heart of poetry. Korzybski thought extensionality
the essence of science. Think about this
and cuss and discuss in the forums.
WEEK THREE ASSIGNMENTS
Read Canto 12 & 13 & my commentaries
Discuss in forums the treatment of “individulism”
in the Cantos as represented thus far by Odysseus [Canto I],
Malatesta [Cantos 8-11], the usurers [Canto 12]
and Kung fu Tse. [Canto 13]
Does the poem seem pro-individalism or anti?
Or does it display a “hierarchy of values”– e.g. great,
good enough, bad, terrible?
Read posted article on language and thought.
Discuss in relation to ideogrammic method and EP’s changes in style between & within Cantos.
WEEK FOUR ASSIGNMENTS
Read chapters 2 to 5 in ABC OF READING
Discuss the equation “dichten=condensare” in the forums
Compare EP’s definitions with my own, “Greatness in writing signifies high INFORMATION.”
Do I disagree with Ez
or have I merely restated his view in cybertalk?
DARE to make your OWN personal list of Inventors, Masters etc. without reference to Ez’s list
Continue discussion in forums the treatment of “individulism” in the Cantos as represented thusfar by Odysseus [Canto I], Malatesta [Cantos 8-11], the usurers [Canto 12] and Kung fu Tse [Canto 13]
WEEK FIVE ASSIGNMENTS
WEEK 6 ASSIGMENTS
Read Canto 17 with my commentary.
Discuss or just cuss in Forums.
Since you didn’t do it last week,
read and comment on the selection from
Uncle Bob’s Treasury of Great Poems (now in Assignment Archive).
Read updated commentary below. Cuss or discuss.
Norbert Weiner, co-creator of Information Theory
and thus of the Net on which we speak to each other,
wrote in 1948 that great poetry contains more information than political speeches.
We cannot measure or define Information without
including the Receiver in the measurement or definition.
This PRECISELY mirrors the observer/observed
synergy in quantum mechanics but has received less publicity.
The only Information scenically and mathematically
measurable = the inability of the Receiver to guess
what’s coming next [the next “signal.’] In political
speeches, measurable information runs very near
the theoretical infinitesimal; you always know
what’s coming next.
In a “good” poem you don’t
know what’s coming next;
the greatest poems
[or fragments of poems]
consist of those that
have the faintly “spooky” quality of never
losing something of their original unpredictability,
for at least some Receivers.
These “fragments I have shelved [shored]” wd not illustrate
this so well if I had attached the author’s name
to each, thereby triggering conditioned reflexes.
How does each poetry selection illustrate —
or fail to illustrate — Weiner’s definition of high information?
If you have no ideas on any of these topics,
discuss something else, so I’ll at least know you’re alive.
WEEK 7 ASSIGMENTS
Canto 20 with commentary
read, meditate and write your own comments in the Forum
WEEK 8 ASSIGMENTS
to the ideogrammic age….. [source unknown]
Read and discuss article in the forum
WEEK 9 ASSIGMENTS
Be sure to see the movie of the week, Educating Rita,
and note isomorphisms with
Frankenstein, Simone and My Fair Lady.
Compare isomphisms of King Kong and Behind the Green Door
Based on the definitions given earlier,
write extensional/ideogrammic definitions of
Guide: an extensional/ideogrammic definition of US presidents:
Washington, Adams, Jefferson, Madison, Jackson, Bush, Clinton, Carter, Roosevelt, Adams, Bush, Harrison, Harrison, Roosevelt etc
Read and discuss in forum:
to the ideogrammic age…..
WEEK 10 ASSIGMENTS
Read E and E-Prime
and do the exercizes
WEEK 11 ASSIGMENTS
Study and discuss Cantos 31 & 32
[Commentary in the course forum…]
Compare this ideogram [Jefferson/Adams] with those concerning Odysseus, Malatesta, the Medici, Confucius, Baldy Bacon.
How much commentary seems really necesary?
How much does each ideogram ‘comment’ on the others?
Do you begin to grok ideogammic method?
WEEK 12 ASSIGMENTS
Well, this course ended more quickly than
I expected. I hope you all enjoyed yourselves
as much as I did — and maybe even learned as
much as I did!
Some final notions —
go to the World Game and explore [& have fun!]:
Does ideogrammic method help you strategize in this game?
Compare this ideogram [Fullerworld] with Pound’s Cantos
concerning Odysseus, Malatesta, the Medici, Confucius, Baldy Bacon, Jefferson/Adams.
Fuller and Pound knew and appreciated each other’s work.
How many points of isomorphism can you detect?
Hope to hear from you again, maybe in another course!
forgetfully WEEK ONE
I seem to have 44 of you in this seminar — 42 students, our Beloved Academy Admin, and an anonymous invited guest. By holy Qabala 44 = Horus. Does this mean something?
I don’t know; but according to Aleister Crowley we entered the Aeon of Horus 100 years ago — 100 years, 3 months and 20 days ago, if I calculate correctly. But perhaps that merely indicates whimsey on my part….
I hope and expect this seminar will prove a Learning Experience for all of us, especially me. I also hope we will all find it a lot of fun….
150 years ago, more or less, Emerson synthesized the barely emerging science of neuro-linguistics into a memorable mantra:
“Every word is a fossilized poem.”
That sentence ignited a flaming perception in the brain of a Harvard student named Ernest Fenollosa, and when Fenollosa died in 1914 his notebooks, turned over to Ezra Pound, ignited what some literary historians call the Revolution of the Word. One result: we all respect words a lot more and trust them a lot less.
Thus, while Freudians and Jungians speak of “levels of consciousness” or “unconsciousness,” Gurdjieff of “vibration levels,” Leary of neurological “circuits,” etc. and currently I speak of “dimensions,” this mostly represents a choice of metaphors and not a difference in subject matter.
If you grok that in its fullness, you will also dig why I call this workshop The 8 Dimensions of “Mind” and NOT The 8 Dimensions of Mind. If you don’t get it, hang in there: it will become clear as we proceed.
And just in case that bloody 44 does mean something, read and contemplate Chapter 44 from Crowley’s Book of Lies [falsely so called]:
THE MASS OF THE PHOENIX
The Magician, his breast bare, stands before an altar on which are his Burin, Bell, Thurible, and two of the Cakes of Light. In the Sign of the Enterer he reaches West across the Altar, and cries:
Hail Ra, that goest in Thy bark
Into the Caverns of the Dark!
He gives the sign of Silence, and takes the Bell, and Fire, in his hands.
East of the Altar see me stand
With Light and Musick in mine hand!
He strikes Eleven times upon the Bell 3 3 3-5 5 5 5 5- 3 3 3 and places the Fire in the Thurible.
I strike the Bell: I light the flame:
I utter the mysterious Name.
He strikes Eleven times upon the Bell.
Now I begin to pray: Thou Child,
Holy Thy name and undefiled!
Thy reign is come: Thy will is done.
Here is the Bread; here is the Blood.
Bring me through midnight to the Sun!
Save me from Evil and from Good!
That Thy one crown of all the Ten.
Even now and here be mine. AMEN.
He puts the first Cake on the Fire of the Thurible.
I burn the Incense-cake, proclaim
These adorations of Thy name.
He makes them as in Liber Legis, and strikes again Eleven times upon the Bell. With the Burin he then makes upon his breast the proper sign.
Behold this bleeding breast of mine
Gashed with the sacramental sign!
He puts the second Cake to the wound.
I stanch the blood; the wafer soaks It up, and the high priest invokes!
He eats the second Cake.
This Bread I eat. This Oath I swear As I enflame myself with prayer:
“There is no grace: there is no guilt:
This is the Law: DO WHAT THOU WILT!”
He strikes Eleven times upon the Bell, and cries
I entered in with woe; with mirth
I now go forth, and with thanksgiving,
To do my pleasure on the earth
Among the legions of the living.
He goeth forth.
COMMENTARY [by Crowley]
This is the special number of Horus; it is the Hebrew blood, and the multiplication of the 4 by the 11, the number of Magick, explains 4 in its finest sense. But see in particular the accounts in Equinox I, vii of the circumstances of the Equinox of the Gods.
The word “Phoenix” may be taken as including the idea of “Pelican”, the bird, which is fabled to feeds its young from the blood of its own breast. Yet the two ideas, though cognate, are not identical, and “Phoenix” is the more accurate symbol.
This chapter is explained in Chapter 62. It would be improper to comment further upon a ritual which has been accepted as official by the A.’.A.’.
COMMENTARY BY RAW
PLEASE NOTE that I suggested that you “contemplate” this ritual, NOT that you perform it. Unless you have at least 10 years experince in Magick ritual of the Thelemic sort, you should not try performing any invovation of Horus. Reasons exist why occultists call him the Lord of Force and Fire.
Preface to Second Edition*
*If you only have the first edition, you may skip this and just meditate on how to make fire out of ice.
MAGICK AND CURSES
Do all exercizes in Chapers 1 and 2
1. How many of these exercizes relate to the meta-model? How many to the Milton model? Do any of them comingle the meta-model with the Milton model?
2. Whether you’ve tackled Finnegans Wake before or not, open to the first page [numbered page 3] and write down all the overt or covert references to the Bible you can find. [Next Tuesday I’ll send you my own list.]
3. Why, of all the teachers in the world, did you seek out me? Why of all the years in your life, this year? Try to think of “all” possible answers again…..
4.Contemplate this haiku:
All is cloaked in fog;
The world seems empty, until —
Far off, a gull shrieks.
5. Go to www.gunsanddope.net Study and discuss. [“We are operating on many levels here.”]
6. Rent a DVD or Video of our Movie of the Week, D W Griffith’s masterpiece, INTOLERANCE, and feel free to join the Academy Forum and the discussion of it.
7. Record your exercize results in your Academy Journal
buy Lyrica canada WEEK TWO
What a delightfully intelligent crew we have here…
I’m enjoying this dia-[or multi]-log immensely,
and I hope all of you enjoy it, too
For this week:
Read chapters 3 & 4 of Prometheus Rising
Do at least SOME of the exercizes
Continue at least some of last week’s exercizes
Read my Introduction to Weishaupt
Read the excerpt from the Wilson/Brown interview (full interview)
Read page 3 of FINNEGANS WAKE again, this time looking for
a) Mark Twain
b) Jonathan Swift
c) Lewis Carroll
Read the forum discussions of Bible links on page 3 of Finnegans Wake
Bring forth a Theory of why Joyce left the apostrophe out of Finnegan’s
Week Three Assignments
Read chapter 5 PromRis
Do the exercizes
Add to subjects:
George W Bush
John F Kerry
Try again on exercizes from Chapters 3 and 4
Read Protecting Biblical Marriage
Re-read page 3 of FINNEGANS WAKE looking for possible references to
a. geography & history of Dublin, Ireland
b. geography & history of Dublin, Georgia
Make 4 copies of the Leary Interpersonal Grid [PromRis p 76] using yr scanner or going to a xerox shop
Black out with pencil or crayon all wodges that describe your habitual interpersonal reactions [“games.”]
This represents a profile of the first two dimensions of yr ‘mind.’
Have 3 critters who know you fill out the same grid giving their profiles on you.
PREPARE FOR SHOCKS.
Week Four Assignments
Read chapter 6 PromRis and
DO THE EXERCIZES
Try again on exercizes from Chapters 3 and 4
Re-read page 3 of FINNEGANS WAKE looking
for wot Monty Pythin calls “the naughty parts”–
a. sex and sex organs
b. urination and defecation
If you hain’t already done this, make 4 copies of the Leary Interpersonal Grid [PromRis p 76] using yr scanner or going to a xerox shop
Black out with pencil or crayon all wodges that describe
your habitual interpersonal reactions [“games.”]
This represents a profile of the first two dimensions
of yr ‘mind’
Have 3 critters who know you fill out
the same grid giving their profiles on you.
Compare the different filters we have used on the
opening of FINNEGANS WAKE with different
filters used on “the world” — Christianity, Islam,
Marxism, Buddhism etc etc
Compare LSD with seeing all possible filters at once…..
Week 5 Assignments
Read PM chapters 7 and 8
DO the exercizes
Contribute to Forum with examples
of the acceleration/deceleration dialectic —
using recent or past history
Re-read page 3 of FINNEGANS WAKE looking
for possible references to
a. geography & history of Rome, Italy
b. the Three Stooges
Week 7 Assignments
Read chapter 11 PR
DO the exercizes especially the Christian Science
texts for the month. You can now find them online
If they seem like gibberish,
that’s okay; just do more pranayama and/or
smoke more pot, until you can decipher them.
Contribute to Forum, if you can, any interesting results of exercizes.
Note that Mrs Eddy entangles the meta-model
with the milton-model. Attempt disentanglement.
Read the attached article on Sexual Alchemy
and discuss in the Forum.
Week 8 Assignments
Read chapter 12 PR
DO the exercizes especially 3, 4, 5 and 6
Contribute to Forum, if you can, any interesting results of exercizes.
Read the attached article on Dreams of Flying and discuss in the Forum.
Discuss one of your own experiences with the the neurogentic dimension and/or Jungian Collective Unconscious
Write down at least one dream this week just upon waking and examine Jungian Unconscious insights
Do you think the Jungian Collective Unconscious has been too heavily emphasized?
What other models are useful for these type of consciousness?
If you’ve read Rupert Sheldrake, discuss his “morphogenetic field” as a model for this data.
Week 9 Assignments
Read chapter 13 PM
DO the exercizes
Contribute to Forum, if you can, any interesting results of exercizes.
Read the attached article on CSICON
and discuss in the Forum.
Discuss one of your own experiences with the abnormal or paranormal.
Any UFO experiences?
Read chapters 14 and 15 PM
DO the exercizes
Contribute to Forum, if you can, any interesting results of exercizes.
Read following story and assume it is literally true:
Stephanie and her friend walked into the music store after lunch.
Stephanie wanted to buy the new CD by the group, “No Girls Allowed”.
There was only one other person in the store when Stephanie and her friend arrived.
Stephanie asked, “How much is this CD?”
Stephanie’s friend said, “Here, let me see it.
I don’t think he heard you.
This tag says it costs $11.99.”
Check each of the following inferences as T [true], F [false] or ? [maybe]
1. Stephanie wanted to buy a CD.
2. Stephanie and her friend ate lunch together.
3. Stephanie owns a CD player.
4. There was only one boy in the store.
5. Two girls walked into a music store.
6. There are no boys in the “No Girls Allowed” group.
7. Stephanie and her friend are teenagers.
8. The store’s owner didn’t hear Stephanie because the music was too loud.
9. Stephanie had enough money to buy the CD.
10. The “No Girls Allowed” CD cost $11.99.
11. The owner of the store is a woman.
12. Stephanie wanted to buy a CD as a gift.
13. One of the CDs costs $11.99.
14. There were two boys in the store.
15. The clerk was hard of hearing.
Discuss the tricky ones in the Forum.
Read chapter 16 and attempt the exercizes
Consult http://www.velvet.net/~starchy/ [dead link}
for the Key to Efas Taem
Read and discuss The Relativity of “Reality” in the forum
Assignments — none!!
Altho’ I suggest that you read the last 3 chapters
of PR and discuss in the forum
And I wd/ feel happy if you write short [one sentence]
what you liked most about the course
and what you liked least about the course
Teaching online feels like a new and exciting art
but one which I need to learn by doing. All
feedback will help.
I want to thank all of you for what I have learned,
and I hope you all feel that you have learned
Non illuminati carborundum,
WEEK ONE ASSIGNMENTS
Read Chapters 1-5 in Cosmic Trigger III
Read entries on Howard Hughes Forgeries and
Hughes vs. Rockefeller in Everything Is Under Control
and follow as many of the links as you can until you get tired of turning pages
Read “Mary, Mary, Quite Contrary” essay
Try the following gedakenexperiment:
Why does the opening sentence of James Joyce’s Ulysses have 22 words? Not 21 or 23, but exactly 22?
Why does the Cabalistic Tree of Life have 22 “paths”?
Why does the Tarot have 22 Trumps?
Why does Aleister Crowley’s Magick in Theory and Practice have 22 chapters?
Why does the last book of the Christian Bible [“Revelations”] have 22 chapters?
Why does Revelations appeal strongly to so many serial killers?
Why does the 22-word opening sentence of Ulysses contain “state” in its first word and “cross” in its last?
Have I given you A Vital Clue in these questions or just bamboozled you with coincidences???
WEEK TWO ASSIGNMENTS
Read Chapters 6-10 in Cosmic Trigger III
and discuss in the forum.
Read p3-16 in Saharasia and use the chart on p 5
to classify the vibe of the Republicans;
the Guns&Dope party;
and discuss in the forum.
Read entry on ‘Hawthorne Abendsen’ in Everything is Under Control
Try the following gedakenexperiment:
“Maybe” is a thin reed to hang your life on but it’s all we’ve got.
This may not seem startling to gamers, but it sure woke me up; I learned about it on Law and Order last Sunday.
A type of program called a”bot ” can play a computer game “just like a human” and in the style of any chosen human, given enough skill on the part of the bot-maker.
It seems to me this surpasses virtual reality and approaches electronic cloning. After all, the bot can go on playing after the human has “died.”
A bot can also exist which, like an art forgery, seems to have the style and habits of a certain human but actually emerged from the brain of a clever faker.
This seems to me like virtual virtual reality and electronic immortality of a sort. If a bot plays chess like Alekhine, in what sense can we call Alekhine totally “dead”?
More: computer tech in general as brought us to the stage where producing a photo of a crime or even a moving picture of it does not prove a damned thing anymore. “I saw it with my own eyes” has become a bad joke.
I begin to feel that Maybe Logic will soon replace the Aristotelian either/or, not because of my books or Korzybski’s or von Neumann’s. but because virtual reality and artificial intelligence have destroyed certitude and left us with only degrees of probability.
BTW, do you feel absolutely sure “Robert Anton Wilson” wrote this and not some gol-danged bot?
WEEK THREE ASSIGNMENTS
Read Chapters 11-19 in Cosmic Trigger III
and discuss in the forum.
and discuss in the forum
WEEK FOUR ASSIGNMENTS
Discuss in the forums,
in the order listed
From EVERYTHING IS UNDER CONTROL:
Language as Conspiracy
G I Gurjieff
James Jesus Angleton
Knights of Malta
WEEK FIVE ASSIGNMENTS
If conspiracies never happen, why do so many states and nations have laws against them?
Have our laws resulted from paranoids in power?
In EVERYTHING IS UNDER CONTROL, read and discuss
Consider what I call The Jumping Jesus Phenomenon
Our psychic universe is expanding even more rapidly than the physical universe. Let us define the measurement of known scientific facts in the year 1 A.D. as “one jesus,” using the name of the celebrated philosopher born that year.
Before going any further, let us ask how long it took to arrive at one jesus. One way of estimating is to take the estimated age of homo sapiens, in which case it took 40,000 to 100,000 years.
How long did it take to double this accumulation of knowledge, to achieve two jesuses? It required 1500 years – until 1500 A.D. How long did it take to double again and obtain four jesuses? It required 250 years, and we had four jesuses in our larder by 1750.
The next doubling took 150 years, and by 1900 A.D. humanity had eight jesuses in our information account. The next doubling took 50 years, and by 1950 we had 16 jesuses. The next, ten years, and by 1960 we had 32 jesuses. The next doubling took seven years, and by 1967 we had 64 jesuses. And the next doubling took 6 years; by 1973 we have 128 jesuses.
There is no reason to imagine that the acceleration has stopped. Thus, we almost certainly reached 256 j around 1978-79 and 512 j in 1982.
In short, we are living in a mental transformation space; that is, an omnidimensional halo expanding toward infinity in all directions. And the electronic center of this halo of mentation is possibly everywhere. It is all available to you right where you are sitting now. Just plug in a terminal. The machine doesn’t care who or what you are.
Add the next term to the series:
3.fly by jet
A certain job can be performed either by a human or a machine. We should
1.employ the human because “the devil makes work for idle hands.”
2.employ the human because otherwise he or she might be bored
3.employ the human because there is no way to organize society except by having most people work for wages
4.employ the machine because technology has no function other than to free people from toil.
Add the next term to the series:
1.hunt and gather
There is a magic machine with two buttons, each of which will create equality among humans. You will push
1.the button that makes everybody equally poor
2.the button that makes everybody equally rich
Working for wages
1.has always existed and always will exist
2.is ordained by God
3.did not appear on large scale until the Enclosure Acts drove the serfs off the land in the past 300 years
4.will become obsolete in the next 100 years
5.will become obsolete in the next 10 years
The best way to search for Higher Intelligence is to
1.find the right religion
2.support Carl Sagan’s Project Cyclops, which is searching for radio signals from advanced civilizations in the galaxy;
4.research our own nervous system
5.build a starship and go looking.
Add the next term to the series:
How much of the changes now happening result from conspiracies?
How much from the Jumping Jesus Phenomenon?
Ponder and discuss Lenin’s words on his deathbed:
“THE MACHINE CONROLS THE ENGINEERS!”
WEEK SIX ASSIGNMENTS
Read “Malthus, Machiavelli, and Pop-Ecology” from my 1982 book,
RIGHT WHERE YOU ARE SITTING NOW
Cuss and/or discuss in the forum.
Ponder Bucky Fuller’s claim that “we”
remain hooked on mideastern oil because the
corporate state hasn’t figured out how to put a METER
between us and the sun.
In EVERYTHING IS UNDER CONTROL, read and discuss
Gerard de Sede
Golden Apple Corps
Holy Order of the Lemon
The Sirius Mystery
WEEK SEVEN ASSIGNMENTS
Read Cosmic Trigger III, Chapter 22. “Beneath the Planet of the Priory of Sion.”
How much of this stuff seems “real’?
How much seems like fantasy or science fiction?
Could some of it make sense as metaphor?
In EVERYTHING IS UNDER CONTROL, read and discuss
Philip K Dick
Robert Morning Sky
Philip J Corso
Crying of Lot 49
Do you think this course intends to teach you new ways of reading and evaluating,
or to gradually reveal the Most Monstrous Conspiracy in the Galaxy?
WEEK EIGHT ASSIGNMENTS
In EVERYTHNG IS UNDER CONTROL read & discuss
John Birch Society
In Banks We Trust
The Naked Pope
Noble Drew Ali
World War II Deniers
Read and discuss–
A John Birch View:
The Red/Blue Map vs. Conspiracy Theories [source unknown]
WEEK NINE ASSIGNMENTS
EVERYTHING IS UNDER CONTROL
President George Bush
The Second George Bush
Skull and Bones
I’m just learning to use my new computer….more comments Will follow later!
You are the most complicated thing in the cosmos. You can’t figure you out.
WEEK TEN ASSIGNMENTS
A basic crack will split the GOP’s Christian/Capitalist coalition apart.
Xtianity, a faith-based system, does not have to accept ANY facts at all, at all, and wd like to ban research-based groups.
Capitalism, a profit-based system, has to recognize SOME facts [those related to profit] and cannot afford to ban all research-based groups.
Out of this tiny crack an earthquake will emerge
What do you think? and how does this relate to conspiracies in general?
Read and discuss from EIUC
John Adams on Banking
Bank of England
WEEK ELEVEN ASSIGNMENTS
Read. Worry about. Discuss:
EVERYTHING IS UNDER CONROL
John F Kennedy Asssassination
Martin Luther King Assassination
Murder of Marilyn Monroe
Mary Pinchot Meyer
Eladio del Valle
“The Whole Bay of Pigs Thing”
ALBERT Guy Bogard
George de Mohrenscholdt’
The Three Tramps
Robert Kennedy Assassination
Does this look like coincidence? Happenstance? or–Something Sinister?
Meditate upon Ian Fleming’s aphorism “Once is happenstance, twice is coincidence, three times is enemy action.”
Consider and discuss synchronicity as yet another alternative…
Week Twelve Assignments
Divide all the groups we have examined into two groups – those fundamentally faith-based and those basically research-based. Does history make sense as a long quarrel between these two forces?
Does our society seem more faith-based or more research-based?
From what you know about Jefferson and our founders, do they seem more on one side or the other?
Read in EVERYTHING IS UNDER CONTROL –
THE UMRELLA MAN
THE 23 ENIGMA
HAPPY HOLIDAYS and I hope to chat with you all Thursday!
Bell’s Theorem, a mathematical demonstration by physicist John Stewart Bell published in 1965, has become more popular than Tarot cards with New Agers, who think they understand it but generally don’t. Meanwhile it remains controversial with physicists, some of whom think they understand it but many of whom frankly admit they find it as perplexing as a chimpanzee in a Beethoven string quartet.
In a [hazardous] attempt to translate Bell’s math into the verbal forms in which we discuss what physics “means,” Bell seems to have proved that any two “particles”once in contact will continue to act as if connected no matter how far apart they move in “space” or “time” [or in space-time.] You can see why New Agers like this: it sounds like it supports the old magick idea that if you get ahold of a hair from your enemy, anything you do to the hair will effect him.
Unfortunately, things “aren’t” that simple.
Most physcists think a long series of experiments, especially those of Dr Alain Aspect and others in the 1970s and Aspect in 1982 have settled the matter. Particles once in contact certainly seem “connected,” or correlated, or at least dancing in the same ballet….But not all physicists have agreed. Some, the AntiBellists, still publish criticisms of alleged defects in the experiments. These arguments seem too technical to be summarized here, and only a small minority still cling to them, but this dissent needs to be mentioned since most New Agers don’t know about it. You can find more about this here. [See also, for general problems associated with Bell’s Theorem]
The most daring criticism of Bell comes from Dr N. David Berman of Columbia, who believes he has refined the possible interpretations of Bell down to two: (1) non-locality [“total rapport”] and (2) solipsism. We will explain non-locality below, but Dr Berman finds it so absurd that he prefers solipsism. [“Is The Moon There When Nobody Looks?”Physics Today, April 1985. He says it isn’t.]
Among those who accept Bell’s Theorem, Dr David Bohm of the University of London offers three interpretations of what it means:
‘It may mean that everything in the universe is in a kind of total rapport, so that whatever happens is related to everthing else [non-locality]; or it may mean that there is some kind of information that can travel faster than the speed of light; or it may mean that our concepts of space and time have to be modified in some way that we don’t understand.”(London Times, 20 Feb 1983)
Bohm’s first model,”total rapport,” also called non-locality, brings us very close– very, very close — to Oriental monism: “All is One,” as in Vedanta, Buddhism and Daoism. It also brings us in hailing distance of Jungian synchronicity, an idea that seems “occult” or worse to most scientists, even if it was once endorsed by Wolfgang Pauli,a quantum heavyweight and Nobel laureate. You can see why New Agers like this; it is argued with unction and plausibility in Capra’s The Tao of Physics. It means the particles “are” correlated because everything “is” correlated.
The strongest form of this non-local model is called super-determinism and means that everything”is” one thing, or at least one process. From the Big Bang to the last word of this sentence and beyond, nothing can be other than it is,since everything is part of a correlated whole. Nobody has openly endorsed this view but several (Stapp, Herbert et al) have accused others, especially Capra, of unknowingly endorsing it.
Bohm’s second alternative, information faster-than-light, brings us into realms previously explored only in science-fiction. Bell’s particles may be correlated because they are parts of an FTL (faster than light) cosmic Internet. If I can send an FTL message to my grandpa, it might change my whole universe to the extent that I wouldn’t be here at all. [E.g., he might be so shocked that he wouldn’t survive to reproduce.] This must either be rejected as impossible, or else it leads to the “parallel universe” model. I’m here in this universe, but in the universe next door the message removed me, so I never sent it there.
Even more radical offshots of this notion have been offered by Dr John Archibald Wheeler and Dr Jack Sarfatti. Dr Wheeler has proposed that every atomic or sub-atomic experiment we perform changes every particle in the universe everywhichway in time, back to the Big Bang. The universe is in constant creation, as in Sufism, but atomic physicists “are” its creators.
Dr Sarfatti is working on the theory of information-without-transportation and hopes to develop an FTL system which will indeed allow me to send an email (or its equivelant) to Julius Ceasar with all the paradoxes that might result producing multiple parallel universes.
Dr Bohm’s third alternative, modification of our ideas of space and time, could lead us anywhere…including back to the Kantian notion that space and time do not exist, but are only human projections, like persistent optical illusions.(Some think Relativity already demonstrates that…) The particles are correlated because they never moved in space or time, because space and time are just “in our heads.”
And there are other alternatives. Harrison (see URL above) suggests that we may have to abandon Aristotelian logic, i.e give up classifying things into only the two categories of “true and real” and “untrue and unreal.” In between, in Aristotle’s excluded middle, we may have the “maybe” proposed by von Neumann in 1933, the probabilistic logics (percentages/gambles) suggested by Korzybski, the four-valued logic of Rapoport (true, false, indeterminate and meaningless) or some system we haven’t found yet.
Others would rather give up “objectivity” — the basic pre-Bell axiom that we can describe an external world apart from our experiments or meddlings. Some say this rejection of objectivity was always meant by the Copenhagen Interpretation (invented by Neils Bohr long before Bell appeared,c 1926 in fact.) Generally, the Copenhagen view is stated as, We can only describe observer-observed interactions; we can never know anything about any hypothetical “observed” without an observer. Sounds like Zen to some, but others fear this is opening the door to Dr Berman’s solipsism and the moon that “is” only there when we look at it….
Bell’s Theorem “means a whole new ball game,” physicist Saul Paul Sirag told the present author once. Unfortunately, as we have seen, nobody feels really sure about the rules of the new game.
All we can say for sure is that “reality” ain’t what it used to be.
Introduction to Adam Weishaupt’s Diogenes’ Lamp
by Robert Anton Wilson
Rarely is the question asked: Is our children learning? –George W. Bush
The only book you’ve got to read is The Godfather. That’s the only one that tells how the world is really run. –Roberto Calvi, President, Banco Ambrosiano; stretched, London, 18/6/1982
Adam Weishaupt founded — or revived — the secret Order of the Illuminati on May 1, 1776; that much seems like Historical Fact. All else remains disputed and heatedly controversial.
Most historians believe the Illuminati originally recruited only high degree Freemasons, and every generation since 1785 — when the Bavarian government discovered and outlawed the Illuminati — Freemasons have faced the charge that they remain “under Illuminati control.”
They all deny it, of course.
Well, not all of them; a Scotch Freemason, John Robison, in his Proofs of a Conspiracy , claimed the damned Illuminati had taken over Continental European Masonry; he wrote chiefly to warn the lodges of England, Scotland and Ireland against a similar coup.
Ever since Robison, the Masonic/Illuminati debate has included those who think the Weishauptians have taken over all Freemasoic lodges, those like Robison who think they’ve only infiltrated some, and those, including the Encyclopedia Britannica, who see Illuminism as a “short-lived movement of Republican free thought” which never had a major influence on Masonry — or on anything else.
But the Illuminati debate covers a lot more ground than that.
For example: Kris Millegan in his Fleshing Out Skull & Bones presents that Yale society as a branch of the Illuminati. In case you don’t know, some prominent Bonesmen have included Bush I, Bush II, Henry Luce of Time, Justice Potter Stewart, an all-star cast of the Captains of American banking, publishing and politics, and most of the directors of the C.I.A….. oh, yes, and John Kerry.
Sure you really want to know more about this?
From another angle, Akron Daraul, in his History of Secret Societies, argues that Weishaupt did not invent but only refurbished the Illuminati, which he relates to earlier movements known as the Holy Vehm (Germany), Allumbrados (Spain),Roshinaya (Persia) etc.; while the more exuberant John Steinbacher in Novus Ordo Seclorum traces them all the way back to the Garden of Eden! They were founded, he says, by Cain, the son not of the holy marriage of Adam and Eve but of an illicit and Satanic coupling between Eve and the Serpent.
How’s that for Hot Stuff? Bestiality, Satanism and all the themes for a new X Files movie……
Meanwhile, Eliphas Levi’s History of Magic traces the Illuminati back to Zarathustra and claims its secret doctrine came down to Weishaupt via Manichaeism, the Knights Templar and Freemasonry. This places them as part of the same occult tradition as Giordano Bruno, Dr. John Dee, Aleister Crowley and the Sufis of Islam.
But on the fourth or fifth hand, a British researcher named Nesta Webster sees the Illuminati as the brains behind socialism, communism, anarchism, and the Prussian government from 1776 to 1918. [She wrote shortly after England’s first war with the latter.]
On the sixth hand, J.F.,C. Moore argues that the Illuminati, a secret source of fascist occultism, inspired such odd birds as Aaron Burr, Adolf Hitler and J. Edgar Hoover; but Philip Campbell Argyle-Smith clams they are extraterrestrial invaders from the planet Vulcan. They call themselves “Jews” on this planet, he adds.
Whether that means all Jews “are” Vulcans or only some of them seems unclear to me, but the most famous Vulcan, Mr. Spock, “is” Jewish insofar as being performed by a Jewish actor makes one at least partially “Jewish,” whatever that means.
Maybe Argyle-Smith has looked at too many Star Trek movies.
He also credits the Illuminized Vulcans with managing the Thugs of India, the Zionists in Israel, the Rothschild banks, the Communist International, the Theosophical Society, Freemasonry and the Assassins of medieval Afghanistan. I don’t know why he left out George Bush and Al Qaeda; probably he just wrote too soon.
Another Cosmic Illuminati theory appeared in the East Village Other June 1969; it included Skull & Bones, the Rothschilds, the Nation of Islam [“Black Muslims”], Richard Nixon, the Black Panthers, the Bank of America, the Rosicrucians, the Holy Vehm, the Federal Reserve and the Combine’s Fog Machine. That one must contain some hidden jokes [I hope].
According to the RogerSpark, a radical Chicago newspaper [July 1969] Weishaupt actually murdered George Washington and served in his place for his two terms as president.[Then who wrote Weishaupt’s books? Hegel maybe; they sounds like him at times……]
The John Birch Society, of course, has a different slant on all this. According to Gary Allen, the editor of their news magazine, American Opinion, Adam Weishaupt “was” a “monster” but the Illuminati only got really monstrous after its capture by English adventurer/billionaire Cecil Rhodes, who used it to establish British domination of the world. The Council on Foreign Relations acts as its most important “front” in the U.S. today, according to Allen.
Sandra Glass, however, thinks of the Illuminati as a group of clandestine pot-heads [cannabis abusers] which included the medieval Assassins, Weishaupt, Goethe, Washington, the first mayor Richard Daly of Chicago and Ludvig van Beethoven.
“Beethoven?” you may gasp. Well, oddly enough, a recent, scholarly and non-conspiratorial biography of the great Ludwig van, by Maynard Solmon, says Mr B wrote some of his music under commission from the Illuminati and had many friends in the Order itself. Solomon doesn’t mention the pot, though; maybe Ludvig, like a recent president with a perpetual hard-on, didn’t inhale.
Then again, Adam Gorightly in The Prankster and the Conspiracy claims that all recent Illuminati research [post-1960s] has become confused and chaotic because of a hoax conspiracy, also called the Illuminati, founded by one Kerry Thornley, a man accused of involvement in the JFK assassination by New Orleans D.A. Jim Garrison. According to Gorightly, this neo-Illuminati aims only to bedevil and mock the efforts of sincere conspiracy researchers, and he even accuses the author of this essay [me, R.A.W.] of involvement in this Fiendish Plot!
I, of course, refuse to dignify this absurd charge with a denial, which nobody would believe anyway. Besides, as Rev. Ivan Stang of the Church of the Sub-Genius says in Maybe Logic, “Well, if I was a member of the Illuminati, I wouldn’t say so, would I?”
We are not victims of the world we see, we are victims of the way we see the world.
— Dennis Kucinich
I think God is sending us a message: “If you can’t take a joke, go fuck yourselves.”
What does this book reveal about the “real” Adam Weishaupt and the “real” Illuminati?
A book works like a mirror, somebody said once: when a monkey looks in, no philosopher looks out. I can only tell you what this book seems to me; others, I feel certain, will find other things in it — including coded references to Vulcans, Skull & Bones, Zarathustra, the Holy Vehm, communism, Mary Magdalene, the Federal Reserve, the Combine’s Fog Machine et.al.
To me, this book seems to support the most cautious and conservative of my sources, the Encyclopedia Britannica, and old Adam looks much like a weary defender of “Republican free thought,” 18th Century style. In other words, he seems a distant relative, philosophically speaking, of Adam Smith, Hume, Voltaire, Jefferson, Franklin, Tom Paine — i.e. of all those libertarian ideas currently as unfashionable in this country as in the Bavaria in Weishaupt’s day. I know why he seems weary to me: trying to teach liberation to people who feel reconciled to their slavery can really grind you down, in 1804 or 2004…
I also think I see an influence of Kant, and perhaps a foreshadowing of Hegel, in the semantic structure used continually by Weishaupt — “X seems true; not-X also seems true; we’ll have to think more about that.” Aquinas did the same trick, but always comes down on the side of safe orthodoxy, Papist flavor. Weishaupt throws the ball back to the reader,although you may not always catch him doing that.
I do not see any conclusive proof that the Illuminati plotted anything nefarious or even illegal, except insofar as free thought itself remained illegal in southern Europe. But I also don’t see any conclusive proof that they wouldn’t and couldn’t and didn’t do nasty things. As a secret society hidden inside the secret society of Freemasonry, the Illuminati will always remain somewhat mysterious, and pedants and paranoids will argue about it until the last galoot’s ashore.
Perhaps Tom Jefferson got it right, when he said that secret societies seemed necessary in Europe, haunted by monarchy and Papism, but not in the United States. Certainly, when the Constitution remained the law of the land [i.e. before the Supremes (s)elected Bozo] no sane person would feel the need for secret societies here. Do I dare add “But now with the Constitution in cryonic suspension –“?
No: I better not….better safe than sorry….
On the other hand, not just secret societies but secrecy itself or even privacy seem increasingly impossible under the reign of George III.
They have hidden cameras everywhere.
They bug our phones.
If they want to, they can “read” every keystroke on my computer, including this one:
They can even pry into the contents of our bladders, in random tests explicitly forbidden by that wonderful, moribund Constitution. Sweet grieving Jesus, there’s no place we can escape or hide or feel alone, is there?
Sometimes, tossing and trying to sleep in the wee hours, I explore the ideas rejected by my skeptical waking mind. Maybe the most paranoid fantasies about the Illuminati contain some truth. .. maybe….
Maybe the All-Seeing Eye on the dollar bill does represent the totally fascist state those bastards want.
Maybe all those Internet rants about Skull and Bones serving as a recruiter for the Illuminati have some foundation in fact, after all.
Maybe we should really worry when the choice in the next election remains limited to two rich Bonesmen…What is it Weishaupt wrote?– “Whoever is rich — very rich — can do anything….”
Maybe we should regard “Illuminati” as a generic term, or a metaphor?
Maybe every Power Structure acts a lot like the most paranoid fantasies about the Illuminati, especially when it feels threatened.?
No, no — that way lies madness, schizophrenia and Usenet trolls. After some sound sleep, I wake, the shadows flee, and I remember that “all’s for the best in this best of all possible worlds.”
Voltaire didn’t intend that as sarcasm, did he?
Robert Anton Wilson
Somewhere in Occupied U.S.A.
23 February 2004
Recommended Reading and viewing:
Argyle-Smith, Philip Campbell — High IQ Bulletin, Colorado Springs 1970, IV, 1
Bauscher, Lance — MaybeLogic, http://www.maybelogic.com
Daraul, Akron — History of Secret Societies, Citadel Press NY, 1961.
Ellul, Jacques — Violence, Seabury Press, NY,1969.
Glass, Sandra — “The Conspiracy,” Teenset, March 1969.
Gorightly, Adam — The Prankster and the Conspiracy, ParaView Press, NY, 2003.
Gurwin, Larry — The Calvi Affair, Pan Books, London, 1984.
Knight, Stephen — The Brotherhood, Grenada, London, 1984.
Levi, Eliphas — History of Magic, Borden Publishing, Los Angeles, 1963.
Millegan, Kris — Fleshing Out Skull & Bones,Trineday, Walterville, OR, 2003.
Moore, J.f.C. — “The Nazi Religion,” Libertarian American, August 1969.
Morals, Vamberto — Short History of Anti-Semitism, Norton, NY, 1976.
Robison, John — Proofs of a Conspiracy, Christian Book Club, Hawthorn, CA, 1961.
Solomon, Maynard — Beethoven, Schirmer Books, NY, 1977.
Vankin, Jonathan — Conspiracies, Cover-Ups and Crimes, IllumiNet Press, Lillburn,GA, 1996.
Webster, Nesta — World Revolution, Constable, London, 1921.
Wilgus, Neal — The Illuminoids, Sun Press, Albuquerque NM, 1977.
Robert Anton Wilson
In Conversation With R.U. Sirius
from Neofiles @ LifeExtention.com
In a smarter world, Robert Anton Wilson would be widely acknowledged as one of the most important writers and thinkers in America. Of course, there is a smarter world within this one, and Wilson has a huge following both nationally and internationally. Most of our culture, indeed, operates beneath or beyond the mainstream media’s radar.
For many of us, Wilson is a subversive sage. He didn’t coin the phrase “guerrilla ontology” but he has been the world’s most valuable practitioner (MVP). The guerrillaontologist is a kind of memetic warrior who lives to dynamite people’s static reality tunnels (belief systems or b.s.). Since The Illuminatus Trilogy, a fictional tour de force published in 1975, he has managed to combine the most extravagant surrealism with unimpeachable logic; sometimes leaving us guessing as to which of these tactics he was employing.
Favorite books include the aforementioned Illuminatus Trilogy, Cosmic Trigger, and The Illuminati Papers, Masks of the Illuminati, The Earth Will Shake, and Prometheus Rising. (Many of you have your own list of faves, no doubt). NeoFiliacswho are willing to risk having the walls fall down around their own belief systems should read (or re-read) The New Inquisition: Irrational Rationalism and the Citadel of Science, published in 1986.
Now at 71-years-old, Wilson has spent the last few years fighting off Post-Polio Syndrome with a little help from medical marijuana. At the same time, he wrote T.S.O.G.: The Thing that Ate the Constitution, a coruscating and hilarious rant against the current rulers of the USA, which he calls the “Tsarist Occupation Government.” T.S.O.G. rips into the drug war, imperial militarism, and a million or so other absurdities in a land ruled by “the Bush crime family.” And he appeared in a superb documentary about his life and philosophy called Maybe Logic.
Four of us gathered in Marin for a drive down to Santa Cruz to see the Wizard. The caste of characters that participated in this conversation includes:
Will Block: CEO of Life Enhancement Products and a long time friend and fan of Bob
Severe Tire Damage: Part of the original cast of characters around Mondo 2000 and another BobManiac
Videobrain (a.k.a. Eve): She goes all the way back to “The Network,” a group who would gather at Wilson’s Berkeley home to SMI2LE. She’s been confusing Mr. Wilson at regular intervals ever since.
RU Sirius: That’s me. I stole my pseudonym from RAW’s hallucinations. ‘Nuff said.
NEOFILES: Stem cell research, gay marriage … can panicky neophobes block the future?
ROBERT ANTON WILSON: They can’t stop scientific research. They keep on trying. Throughout all history they tried, but scientific research continued even during the inquisition. They can slow it down but they can’t stop it. Stem cell research will just continue in other countries.
NF: William Burroughs used to say that “the mark of a basic shit is that he can’t mind his own business.” I’ve been thinking about that during this gay marriage controversy. I mean, why in the world would anyone think that what those people over there are doing ruins it for me?
RAW: Yeah … what the hell is with that?! I saw Bob Barr debating Barney Frank on TV and Barr said that gay marriage will dilute the meaning of marriage. And Frank was saying, “I can’t understand. What would someone else’s marriage have to do with your marriage?” And Bob Barr said, “I don’t mean my marriage, I mean the institution of marriage.” It’s so damn stupid. Talk about “diluting” an “institution” makes as much sense as asking “Why is a duck?” Barr lives in the 13th Century. Next he’ll inquire into how many angels can dance on the head of a Pookah.
NF: I was trying to figure it out the other day and I realized it’s not even so much about bigotry, it’s just these people saying “the world is changing too fast. Make it stop.” Maybe we should take the state out of marriage entirely.
RAW: Have you looked at my Guns & Dope website?
NF: I have.
RAW: My new mantra is “Everybody for President.” Everybody can write in their own name and take responsibility forthemselves. We’re not going to pass on our responsibility to some asshole like George Bush or a Congress of assholes and corporate whores. We’re going to take our own responsibility. We don’t need a czar. Who the hell needs a fucking czar? Why should 21st century America be like 19th century Russia? My doctor and I can make our own medical decisions for me. The whole idea of the TSOG — the Tsarist Occupation Government — is that the Tsar is in communication with God just like in 19th Century Russia. He knows how to handle my health problems better than me and my doctor and my friends and family. And he does it without even seeing me! He knows because he’s in direct communication with God. And this horseshit is what the American people are supposed to believe? I don’t believe it. I think he’s a political hack. I don’t think he knows anything about my health at all. I’d like to debate him. Or I’d like to ask him about my health problems … “Do you think I can go back to eating chocolate now that I’m no longer officially borderline diabetic?” (my doctor changed my status to non-diabetic six months ago.) Does the Tsar and his God want to over-rule that medical opinion too?
NF: What do you think of the Barr McClellan scandal? One of this guy’s sons is press secretary to President Bush; another is head of the FDA. And their dad, a lawyer for LBJ, has written a book claiming that LBJ shot JFK … had him shot.
RAW: I have a copy of the TV special about that on video. They have about four or five inside figures who say he did it. It’s pretty interesting. It’s kind of a fringe theory. Most people think it was the CIA or the Mafia, and the worst most people say about LBJ is that he knew about it. But that’s the way LBJ worked. He got rid of people he didn’t like. And now the whole LBJ family is all screaming about slander and libel. I don’t know but it’s interesting.
NF: So what’s happening with the medical marijuana situation here in Santa Cruz?
RAW: Well, we’ve decentralized it. They’ll have to raid 100 gardens next time or maybe 200. It’s very decentralized. It’s working very well. I mean, what the hell are they going to do, arrest everybody in Santa Cruz County? 85%support medical marijuana. And it’s pretty much the same in San Francisco, Oakland, Berkeley, and the Counties of Mendocino, Humboldt, Marin, and Los Angeles … everybody knows that California is the marijuana capital of the country. They can’t really do anything about it. All the Tsar and his God can do is huff and puff.
NF: It always wins wherever it gets on the ballot so why don’t any mainstream politicians back medical marijuana?
RAW: I have three theories on this one. In the first place, if you’re of a superstitious nature, you’re afraid of marijuana. Politicians want to appeal to people who are of a superstitious nature. That’s the largest voting bloc in the whole country. And then there are the pharmaceutical companies. If anybody can treat their own pain by growing a plant in their own house or on their own balcony … you could see a very sudden drop in the use of very expensive painkillers that are legal and addictive. And people will go with this example and look into other herbs as well. That’s a real threat to the pharmaceutical monopoly that gives a lot of money to both the parties in every election.
NF: I always thought baby boomer “liberals” like Al Gore were just being hypocritical about medical marijuana but I was thinking about it recently and realized that they’re probably actually genuinely offended by the idea of routing around the regulatory process through a populist vote.
RAW: I read a book about ten years ago that said that seventy million Americans are pot smokers. How can you keep something that seventy million people do illegal? We’re the largest persecuted minority in the country. Eventually they’re going to have to back down.
If you look at the Dreyfus Case, then you know how governments work. They wouldn’t back down. Everybody inEurope knew he was innocent. Still they held him on Devil’s Island much longer than seems humanly possible. Governments hate to admit mistakes. People for years were lead to believe that the pope was infallible. Governments make more mistakes than anybody else because they don’t have to make a profit. Any other business that operated like the government would go bankrupt. They don’t go bankrupt; they just borrow more money and charge us the interest on it. They borrow more money from the Federal Reserve, the Federal Reserve prints the money, and then we all have to pay the interest on it forever. My children and great grandchildren and great great grandchildren will still be paying this debt that Bush has run up for his war in Iraq.
NF: One thing that makes me scratch my head are things that slip by, such as galantamine, a grandfathered nutritional supplement that’s also being sold as a drug called Reminyl for Alzheimer’s disease by Johnson and Johnson. Now, J & J is a big pharmaceutical company … yet neither they, nor the FDA, have been able to do anything about its sale as a supplement despite a huge and potentially huger multi-billion dollar market. From everything that you know, you would think that J & J is so powerful that no one could bump heads with them without getting blown out of the water, and ditto for the FDA. Yet they didn’t choose to do that despite their disgruntlement and admission, through the grapevine, that they screwed up. So here is a very powerful pharmaceutical company backed by a very powerful regulatory agency that appears to have its power very unevenly distributed on some levels ….
RAW: It’s my famous SNAFU principle — those on top don’t get accurate honest views from everybody else. Wherever I go I ask audiences if anybody there would swear that they would tell the truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth to someone who was a government employee. Nobody ever raises their hand! Everybody lies to the government. We all want as little to do with them as possible. So that’s the first level of government corruption; theaccumulation of all the lies people tell to people just above them in the hierarchy. They make sure they don’t say anything to the one above them so they don’t have to write up reports or whatever and those above them lie a bit more to please the one above them so by the time the information gets up to George Bush, who knows what he’s getting? So they’re all running around asking, “How did we believe in the weapons of mass destruction when there aren’t any?” And the answer is that when you’re in a hierarchy of that sort, people won’t tell you what they know you don’t want to hear.
NF: Bush the other day was talking about how he met with a group of Iraqis who all told him how thankful they were that America had invaded their country and I thought … “ah hah … the burden of omniscience”
So what gives you the most hope in the midst of all this madness?
RAW: I don’t think politics is all that important. Spending too much time focused on politics leads to total despair with the state of the human race. But if you look at the whole spectrum of human behavior, I think the science and the arts are driving it. I think the sciences and the arts relate to a lot more of human behavior than politics does. They’re going to try to stop developments in science but they’re not going to stop it and it’s going to change everything. I think we’re going to have major breakthroughs in biotech in the next five-ten years and they can’t do a damned thing to stop it. It’s going to change the whole world. Meanwhile the Japanese are planning on building hotels in space.
NF: We just interviewed some people who are planning to build some space hotels.
RAW: Of course. It’s just a game these politicians play. It’s a permanent anchor on development but it never stops it.
NF: So we can just wait ‘em out?
RAW: I don’t know, but the acceleration of change is coming faster and faster all the time. There are more patents every year; more internet website opening every month … change is happening faster and faster everywhere.
Hey, I’ve got a replay TV. I didn’t even know they existed until a couple of months ago. I can set the replay TV and it will record anything I want. I can go to sleep and it will record a movie at three o’clock in the morning that I can watch the next evening. And I don’t have to ever look at a commercial if I don’t want to ever again. Now I can enjoy the TV as much as anybody in the country. I love TV.
NF: Back in the late ‘70s you wrote about the coming immortality pill …
RAW: Oh yeah … heh ….
NF: Are you optimistic about something like that?
RAW: Oh yeah, something like that. I don’t think it will be a single pill but there’s so much going on in biotech. Even now, the number of people on this planet over 100 is more than it’s ever been, and the average age of death inAmerica has gone from 73 to 77 just in the last few years. We’re getting closer to it all the time.
In that film, Maybe Logic, you said that you didn’t think I was really an optimist because you’re not an optimist … so I can’t be an optimist, I must be putting you on. Look in my condition. If I was a pessimist I wouldn’t be walking today. I have to be an optimist. Pessimism is a luxury that only the comfortable can afford.
NF: A recent article in Science by a demographer named James Vaupel has concluded that if there was a limit to the increment in average lifespan — which increases in the world’s healthiest countries by about 2.5 years every ten years — that increment would start to decline indicative of an approaching ceiling. But Vaupel says that the data indicates that there’s no ceiling … or that lifespan is going to shoot right through the presumed ceiling.
RAW: Yeah, Buckminster Fuller points out that most people in the 19th Century died after fifty years … that was the average lifespan … it was 27 in Europe during the French Revolution.
NF: That was an averaging out though wasn’t it?
RAW: Yeah, you have to account for crib deaths.
NF: … there appears to be something happening to increase the probability of longer life for every decade we live … that will tend to enable more of us who hold out to live to100 or more in better, more vibrant health..
RAW: Hell, when George Burns reached one hundred the whole country paid attention. When Bob Hope recently turned 100 hardly anybody noticed.
NF: They’re saying that the universe isn’t even entropic now. Starting with the big bang it just expands ….
Do you feel a rapport with young people?
RAW: It seems to me that every ten years I get a new audience among young people. It seems to me that some of my books are rather dated by now but they keep on selling so I guess they’re not as dated as they seem to me.
NF: I just re-read The Illuminati Trilogy. It was actually only the second time I read it all the way through. I think maybe references to stuff like SDS might be a little bit obscure but that’s about it. The names of the bands are right up to the moment.
RAW: [Laughter] Well, when I write a novel I set it somewhere definite, not in never-never land. So there will always be references specific to whatever time I’m setting it in. That’s not what I mean. I wasn’t thinking about Linda Lovelace or SDS. I was thinking of the scientific knowledge, but I can’t do anything about that.
NF: Is there anything specific that you can think of that you feel has been superceded?
RAW: I can’t think about it right now. You can’t be a generalist in this world. So many things I’ve written about have changed by now I don’t know how out-of-date I am. I just know I must be out-of-date.
NF: Do you follow the cosmological discussions about the origins of the big bang and all of that?
RAW: Nah. I don’t believe in any of it. They keep changing it every few years. It’s all guess work.
NF: I read somewhere recently someone saying that most of the versions of what Bell’s theorem could mean have been eliminated … disproved.
RAW: Yeah, that’s what I mean. I was doing an article about Bell’s Theorem about five years ago. I found out a new interpretation of Bell’s Theorem that I’d never seen before and I wanted to do some more research before writing the article. I had no idea that most of the theories had been discarded. You can’t keep up with everything. I can’t even keep up with Joyce scholarship.
NF: In the process of doing this site, dealing with biotech, brain science, nanotech … it seems like it’s increasingly difficult when you read the literature to distinguish between stuff that has actually happened and stuff that just inevitably will happen.
Do you follow the idea of the Singularity at all?
RAW: No. I know what it is … but I feel that cosmology is not of great interest to me because the models are changing so rapidly. By the time I learn about a model to the point where I can talk about it I have to replace it with a new one. It gets harder as you get older. Isaac Asimov wrote an article called “The Sound of Panting.” It’s about how it’s harder and harder to just keep up with his own field which is biochemistry.
NF: Do you think artificial intelligences … robots … will become smarter than human beings? Do you follow that discussion?
RAW: Definitely. I think they have to. In some ways some of the equipment I have around here is smarter than me. The Replay TV in some respects…
NF: One of the things that always touched me deeply in your work is the level of optimism.
RAW: Well you see I had polio at the age of four. I had to learn to be an optimist or I never would have walked for most of my life. Now I have return [Ed.: Post-] Polio Syndrome and now I’m walking again. If I wasn’t an optimist I’d still be in the goddamned wheelchair. I don’t understand how pessimists survive. If they all believed what they say, they would all sit down and starve to death. You have to have some optimism to accomplish something. When I was a child I just kept falling down. I wouldn’t believe that I couldn’t walk. Eventually I walked…
Now I’m for a war against pain. Medical marijuana laws are a great victory in the war against pain. All you’ve got to do is hang the goddamned TSAR. Let everybody and their doctor decide for themselves what to do with their pain. I don’t see why pain can’t be abolished. I think we could abolish both starvation and pain in the next ten years.
NF: We had an interview with David Pierce who wrote this online book, The Hedonistic Imperative. He talks about abolishing pain and ….
RAW: Yeah, yeah. I’ve seen it. “The Biology of Paradise.” Beautiful stuff ….
NF: Not just eliminating pain but eliminating negative mind states ….
RAW: I’m all for it. Leary was all about that.
NF: You’ve noted before that all the messages that spiritualists get when they channel seem really obvious and banal.
RAW: Yeah, I guess spirits are boring. At least I got something more interesting when I tried it. I got Harvey the rabbit, Olga the Ostrich, the talking dogs from Sirius … a Chinese alchemist, an Irish bard … now I’m channeling Olga. [Laughs]
NF: What are the great scientific paradigms of recent times?
RAW: Well, quantum physics and general relativity and the emerging one I think is neuroscience. We’re receiving billions of signals all the time all over our brain and our brain processes all that. Talk about paradigms. So in my next book, Tale of the Tribe, I deal with Leary’s eight dimensions … I don’t use brain circuits. Brain circuitry is a little bit too mechanistic.
NF: As we lose track of the changes in fields like quantum mechanics how do you keep track of what’s influencing the general culture? How is the general culture being supplied with information?
RAW: I can only talk about the United States. I’ve lived and traveled in Europe but mostly I’ve been in the United States. Most of the culture here is running on a sheer terror of how rapidly things are changing. George Bush might have won the election, it’s at least possible. People are screaming “Go back go back! Let’s have simple answers.” It’s very difficult to have useful answers to everything that’s going on. There aren’t simple answers. Things are complex. We need precise knowledge of complex systems. We don’t need simple answers. Most of the public wants simple answers like let’s stop gay marriage.
Right now the most poplar belief systems or BS in the country are, in descending order, Protestant, Catholic, Agnostic, Buddhist, Jewish, Islam, Mormon, atheist, Sikh, Hindu — I remember the descending order with the mnemonic P-CAB-JIM=ASH. This country is so damn ignorant most of them don’t even know what a Muslim looks like. Four nuns were turned off an airline flight today because they looked like Muslims. They were Hindus! I heard it on CNN.
NF: Have you been to Burning Man?
RAW: The Guns & Dope Party is going to be there. The Guns & Dope party is going to have a presentation at BurningMan. I keep on saying if the gun people and the dope people could get together they would be a majority of the country. All they have to do is get over their paranoia about each other. Really, if the gun owners and dopers could get together we could really overthrow this whole system. After all, anybody who takes your money without your consent and then will try to throw you in prison if you don’t pay up … they’re not going to use the money to do anything for you obviously. They’re going to try to use the money to enslave you. And of course the next step after stealing our money is to take away our guns so we can’t fight back.
We’re living in Robert Anton Wilson’s world
In 1973 Thomas Pynchon published an enormous experimental novel called Gravity’s Rainbow. In 1975 Robert Shea and Robert Anton Wilson published an enormous experimental trilogy called Illuminatus! Both were written at about the same time, and both offered panoramic perspectives on history, liberty, and paranoia.
“The Monster in the Labyrinth”
by Robert Anton Wilson
Foreword to THE PRANKSTER AND THE CONSPIRACY
by Adam Gorightly, 2003
Ye have locked yerselves up in cages of fear — and, behold, do ye now complain that ye lack FREEDOM!
Ye have cast out yer brothers for devils and now complain ye, lamenting, that ye’ve been left to fight alone. –“Epistle to the Paranoids,” The Gospel According to Fred by Kerry Thornley
Kerry Thornley wrote those words in the mid 1960s and within 10 years he had become a clinical paranoid himself, in the judgement of almost all of his friends, including Dr Robert Newport. a psychiatrist who had known Kerry since high school. The moral of this seems to me: take great care which nut cases you dare to mock, for you may become one of them.
I do not write in any spirit of smugness or superiority. I became somewhat paranoid myself, for a while there, or at least experienced acute anxiety attacks. For several months I literally could not leave my house without looking around to see if Kerry crouched behind a bush waiting to shoot me.
You see, he had become convinced that I worked for the C.I.A. and served as one of his “manangers” or “brainwashers,” but I thought I worked as a freelance writer and considered myself his friend. As his letters to me grew increasingly hostile and denuciatory, I began to fear that he might have graduated from “weirded out” to “dangerous.”
This now seems sillly to me — certainly, an over- reaction — but the violence and paranoia of the Nixon years made everbody in this country feel a bit jumpy. A Black Panther leader in my part of Chicago seems to have gotten shot by the local police while sedated; the extreme Right and extreme Left both had wild conspiracy theories about everybody else; anti-war meetings, anti-segregation meetings, even pot-legalization meetings all had people making nervous jokes about who the government had infiltrated among us to report on our Thoughtcrimes. The government not only appeared irrational and out of control, but so did a large part of the population.
I finally moved to Ireland to start a new life as an expatriate, and my worries about Kerry executing me for “brainwashing” him made up only a microscopic part of my motive. The whole country seemed “a bit funny in the head” and I had to hide out and lie low for a while. Silence, exile and cunning, as Joyce had advised.
Looking back, I feel amused and humbled. Like Kerry, I had satirized the paranoids before the sheer number of them frightened me into acting just like one of them.
I remember my last phone conversation with Kerry, during which he announced that just a week earlier I had come to Atlanta, argued with him about my alleged CIA connections, spiked his drink with LSD and brainwashed him again. I told him that I had not left San Francisco in months, and that if he had a Bad Trip last week somebody else gave him the acid, not me. I insisted on this, as persuasively as I could.
Finally, Kerry relented — a bit. “Well, maybe you believe that,” he said. “But that means your bosses have been fucking with your head and implanting false memories in you too!”
How do you argue that you haven’t had your head altered? “Look,” I said, “I’ll put my wife Arlen on. She’ll tell you I haven’t left here in months. ”
“That won’t prove anything,” he said with the calm certitude of a Grand Master announcing checkmate. “They probably fixed her head too.”
I don’t remember the rest of the conversation. I felt lost in an Escher painting.
A few weeks, or a few months, before or after that conversation, the police found a young woman raped and murdered two doors from the house where Arlen and I lived. A few days before or after that atrocity I attended a meeting of the Physics/Consciousness Research Group in which the assembled Ph.D.sserously discusssed a quantum model in which the universe contains only one electron, and everything else, including this seemingly solid Earth, our own bodies and our “minds” [if we still think we have “minds”] results from the virtual interactions of virtual particles, or of probability waves.
So Arlen and I packed up and moved to a land where the wierdest critter, a six-foot-tall white rabbit, seldom roams far from the fens and farmlands.
I’m only kidding — not. – Madonna, Truth or Dare
But let us,as the Chinese say, draw our chairs closer to the fire and examine this soberly.
All the above happened because Kerry and I, with a few others, invented a new religion; and because Kerry and I and a hell of a lot of others dared to doubt the official “lone nut” theory of the JFK assassination.
Perhaps I should say something about the religion before getting into the even murkier waters of the politics.
We called the religion Discordianism and its central catma* declares “All affirmations are true in some sense,
*Other, and hence lesser, religions have dogmas or absolute beliefs. Discordianism only has catmas or relative meta-beliefs. You’ll learn more about that in the book which follows
false in some sense, meaningless in some sense, true and false in some sense, true and meaningless in some sense, false and meaningless in some sense, and true and false and meaningless in some sense.” We owe this Divine Revelation to Gregory Hill [Malaclypse the Younger], the chief architect of Discordianatheology.
In my ministry I have added a rider promising that if you repeat this catma 666 times you will achieve Supreme Enlightenment, in some sense.
Many people consider Discordianism a complicated joke disguised as a new religion. I prefer to consider it a new religion disguised as a complicated joke.
Others consider Discordianism an American form of Zen Buddhism. I think Kerry held that view most of the time.
Whether one considers Discordianism a joke, a new religion or Yankee Zen, it emphatically does not belong in the same arena as Aristotelian logic or criminal law, yet the life of Kerry Thornley dragged it into those precincts and I can find no way to disentangle them in disccussing him. Everybody who ever looked into “the Thornley case” feels a strong need for basic either/or answers to such questions as: Guilty or Innocent? Sane or Insane? Victim of the C.I.A. or victim of his own delusions?
All I can say consists of a devout wish that logic could stretch to include a maybe,or a phalanx of probabilities, between the Aristotelian yes and no, and that our law could include the Scotch “not proven” between guilty and innocent.
I think it entirely posssible that Kerry went bananas on his own, due to genetics and/or traumatic early imprints and/or Too Damned Much LSD and/or other causes unknown, with no help from the C.I.A. at all. I also think it entirely possible that the C.I.A. did subject Kerry — and his Marine Corps buddy Lee Harvey Oswald — to some form of “Manchurian Candidate” mind control and that his seemingly “psychotic” words and actions represented an intelligent man’s attempts to break the strings of his puppet masters and find his way back to a world that made sense again.
In short, I regard all his brilliant satires and all his “psychotic” rants as true in some sense, false in some sense, meaningless in some sense, true and false in some sense, true and meaningless in some sense, false and meaningless in some sense, and true and false and meaningless in some sense.
For instance, you will read in this book about Kerry’s “delusions” concerning fascist manipulations of the C.I.A. and/or Naval Intelligence. Pure nonsense, right?
Wrong. Let me illuminize you a bit.
Nazi worms began to infest the U.S. way back in 1945, when Gen. Rheinhard Gehlen, Hitler’s Chief of Soviet Intelligence, surrendered to the U.S. Army, after first prudently burying several truckloads of “inside information” about the Soviet Union at a secret location.
Gehlen seems not only a master spy but a wizard negotiator. Within a week, he got out of his Nazi uniform and into a U.S. Army General’s uniform; the U.S.intelligence services, in return, got the info about the Soviets, including access to Gehlen’s agents in the Soviet government, – a group of Mystical Tsarists who had infiltrated both the Red Army and the KGB.
You see, their leader and Gehlen’s major “asset,” General Andrei Vlassov, had a fervent belief, not just in common or garden Tsarism but especially in the “mystical Tsarism” espoused in the later half of the 19th Century by the anti-Semitic novelist Dostoyevsky and even more by Konstantin Pobedonostsev, an advisor to two Tsars [Alexander III and Nicholas II].
Pobedonostsev, popularly called “The Grand Inquisitor” because of the vast platoons of spies, snoops, agents provocateur and informers he unleashed upon the Russian people , combined theological obsessions with reactionary politics, always an explosive and nefarious mixture.
“Mystical Tsarism” deserves a whole book in itself. especially since it now rules our own country; but we must remain brief here. This holy religion, or superstition — as you will –has two major tenets: (1) The Tsar is guided by God and can do no wrong (2) Science “is” cold and inhuman, faith “is” warm and human; therefore we should ignore reason and guide ourselves by faith in the Tsar, our “Little Father,” who receives his orders directly from a gaseous vertebrate of astronomical heft called “God.”
I don’t think any of Pobedonostsev’s crew actually believed in the Tooth Fairy, though.
Gen. Gehlen and Gen. Vlassov formed what became the Gehlenapparat, the CIA’s main source of info on Soviet affairs; Gehlen became the fulcrum of the CIA’s “Soviet penetration” sector, working under James Jesus Angleton, Chief of Counter-Intelligence, breeder of prize orchids, lover of the arts, and a devout Catholic.
Since the U.S. government based its foreign policies on CIA reports, and the CIA based its Soviet reports on Gehlen and some other former Nazis, plus a crew of Mystical Tsarists, as filtered and interpreted by a Papist intellectual, the U.S. government’s ideas and actions became increasingly “wierd, ” bizarre and frightening, in the view of the rest of the world. The results seem very sad and very funny. In a nutshell, most of the planet thinks we’ve gone batshit crazy.”Tsarists and Nazis and spooks, oh my!”
As Harry Browne, Libertarian Party candidate for president in 2000, wrote in July 2003, “The whole world is now afraid of America, and America is afraid of the whole world.”
Although James Jesus Angleton served as Gehlen’s alleged supervisor, data indicates that the Gehlenapparat engaged in many activities, including kidnapping, extortion, murder etc. about which Angleton either did not know or devoutly did not want to know.
But James J. Angleton seems to me a pathological case of some sort himself; he often hid his middle name because it revealed his half-Hispanic genes. An exceptionally intelligent and sensitive student of modern literature while at Yale, Angleton adored Ezra Pound, T.S Eliot, I.A. Richards, e e cummings and otherSuperStars of Modernism; he met most of them personally. They collectively influenced Angleton’s fascination with multiple perspectives, Byzantine ambiguity and the eternal uncertainty of all inferences and “interpretations.”
These modernist tendencies, which also appeared in science and philosophy at the same time, blossomed into obsessions and, perhaps, raging madness when Angleton systematically applied them to the spy-game. After all, modernism really begins with Wilde’s “The Reality of Masks” and Yeats’s hermetic theory that the world we know emerges from interactions of Mask, Anti-Mask, Self, and Anti-Self: which may or may not fit all of us or all the world but certainly fits the world of spooks and snoops that Angleton created.
Records indicate that the Oswald who enlisted in the Marines was 5’11”. Comrade Oswald, who went to Russia, was 5’6″. while the dead version measured in at 5’9″. – Richard Belzer, UFOs, JFK and Elvis
Another CIA officer, Edward Petty, described Angleton as “a lone wolf” and “a strange bird”; every other source I have found bluntly calls him “paranoid.” He suspected everybody else in the CIA, and in “our” government generally, of being KGB moles, and he operated with so much modernist ambiguity and hidden trapdoors that, in Petty’s words, “nobody really knows” what he was doing most of the time. In short, he became as esoteric as the poets he admired, and remade the C.I.A. and, increasingly, our whole nation into a theatre of impenetrable mystery.
A.J. Weberman, a leading Kennedy assassination buff, thinks Angleton personally organized the JFK hit, an idea also strongly hinted at by Norman Mailer’s documentary novel, Harlot’s Ghost, in which Angleton appears as “Hugh Montague.” If James Jesus really arranged the JFK assassination, he had probably identified Kennedy as the top Soviet mole of all,at least to his own satisfaction.
Why not? Angleton had Tsarist agents in all sorts of nooks and crannies of the Soviet system, and he knew the KGB was smart enough and tireless enough to reciprocate by planting their own Masks and Anti-Masks in his own backyard, or maybe under his bed at night. According to Edward Jay Epstein, J.J.A.sendless search for Soviet moles nearly destroyed the C.I.A. itself. Certainly, everybody in “the Company” learned to distrust everybody else.
Imagine a U.S. Caine with not one Queeg as captain, but a whole crew of Queegs, each worrying about what the others might be plotting. Angleton created that ship of shape-shifters in the C.I.A. and then by osmosis it spread through the government, evolving into the Tsarist Occupation we now endure.
In short, the government cannot trust us, because it can never know with absolute certainty what mischief we may hatch; and every sentence we speak into a bugged phone may have as many possible meanings as Eliot’s “The rose and the fire are one.”
“Trust No One,” the motto of X Files, seems the only safe rule in the world Angleton created.
We even have a Tsar of our own now, who supervises American medicine. Allegedly, this official knows what drugs, herbs etc. you should use for your medical problems better than your doctor knows, and our Tsar knows this without doing any physical examination, blood pressure readings, other scientific tests etc. that your doctor does, and often from a distance of 3000 miles — without even looking at you.
This makes sense if and only if we have a devout faith that our Tsar, like the Russian Tsars, recives guidance directly from “God;” the government accordingly spends more and more of our tax money financing “faith-based organizations.” Without faith we might relapse into scientific or rational thinking.
Tsarism represents an intermediate form between European monarchism and Asian despotism, being, possibly, closer to the latter of these two. — Leon Trotsky, Russia’s Social Development and Tsarism
How much of this did I dream up the way Kerry Thornley [I still insist] imagined my own C.I.A. activities? For objective info on the Gehlenapparat, and Nazi /CIA links, see The Yankee and Cowboy War by Boston University historian Carl Oglesby [Berkeley Medallion, NY, 1977] On fascist/CIA/Mafia links, excellent books include The Strange Death of God’s Banker by Foot and della Torre[ Orbis, London, 1984] and The Calvi Affair, by Larry Gurwin, of the Financial Times [Pan, London, 1984]
CIA/Mafia “ghost banks” and their strange links with real banks, including Chase Manhattan, are discussed amply in In Banks We Trust, Doubleday, NY, 1984, by Penny Lernoux.
For CIA involvement in general — and Angleton’s personal involvement — in the JFK hit see http://webermancom, probably the largest site on the World Wide Web.
Our most recent Tsar’s responsibility for barbaric war crimes — as bad as any of Thornley’s “fantasies” — appears well documented in “Overwhelming Force,” by Seymour Hersh, The New Yorker, 22 May 2000.
Or — you can find most of the data on Tsarist/fascist infiltrations of “our” government, in one form or another by simply surfing the web. Set your search engine for “Rheinhold Gehlen,” “Cisalpine Bank,””Licio Gelli,” and “Gladio” to start with and follow the links where they lead you. I promise you will find the journey as startling as anything in this book.
I have no certitude about how “crazy” to consider Kerry Thornley on any given day of any year, but I don’t believe he ever became a simple damned fool. Heunnderstood the government of this country better than 99% of its citizens.